New Barrel Association

[BECKY H]

Hey I hope your idea comes into place,there should be a association for those good solid pattered horses,but i have respect for those 1-d horses,think i might spend some time thinking about this,there should be a way to work your idea out.GOODLUCK

[NO RULES HERE]

i like it and I am with you there!! All of my horses are ranch geldings that we team rope on,work cows,pick up at rodeos,ranch rodeo,ranch sort,playday...what freakin ever we want to do!!!! They are usually respected in whatever arena we put them in due to the versatility and athletic abilty that our horses have( i am NOT bragging).I cant afford a heading horse and a heeling horse and so on....

That is EXACTLY what I am talking about!  Mine are mostly mares, but still the same concept!  They will do it all.  My daughter is riding a $1000. quarter horse mare that goes back to two eyed jack and she runs barrels, poles, sorts, trails and just started steer undecorating on her and I would put any kid in the world on this horse in a heart beat, but she will never be a 15 or 16 second horse!

[Downthealley]

so whats the incentive in bettering myself or my horse?  (((

I notice most of the replies on here is from 15 and 16 second runners and it SHOWS!  The incentive here is for all the poeple who run in the 17 second PLUS range!  So if you have a horse just starting out and he is running 18 and 19's, there is you incentive!  RUN a 17 and win more!  SIMPLE!

The only other thing to make it fair for people that can not spend 20 and 30-k for a horse would be pay the winnings back backwards!   1-d always win more money, so turn it around and pay the 4 or 5 d horse more money!  THIS SHOULD SPARK SOME INTEREST! :TIGGER:

actually .. I dont even own a barrel horse at the moment. I never have and never will own a 1D horse and this association doesnt even appeal to me. So you can take your directing comments away from me because I dont even have a barrel horse. All of my horses are pick up horses or head/heel horses. I dont even have the desire to run barrels anymore. But my daughter does and she rides the horses we already have.

We dont spend lots of $$$$$$ on our horses, our best pick up horse was a bareback horse who quit bucking and made the best ridin/ranch horse ever! She will never go anywhere regardless of how much we are offered and we only paid $1k for her 11 years ago. I have not paid that much more for any of our horses. My husband makes every horse we've ever had and that right there is worth more to me than going out and buying a $20k+ horse. We work hard for what we have.

[DOHorsewmn]

My husband makes every horse we've ever had and that right there is worth more to me than going out and buying a $20k+ horse. We work hard for what we have.

I agree - I have made every horse I have (with help from my awesome sister in law) and we work hard for what we have too - so I think that this would be great!  I think this idea is great!

[rchristensen]

With those stats - if you are truly wanting to start a new association to cater to the "slower horses".  Why not have a regular D race and pay according to how many horse where in that "D".  37 horses in 1D would pay 3 places, 251 horses in the 2D would pay 12 places (or more), 424 horses in the D would pay 25 places or more, etc etc.  Or after you got the Fastest time and divided like a "D" like a regular barrel race - take the 2D and divide in .25 sec (17.0, 17.25,17.5) and pay out the number of places for that amount of horses.  Slower horses get more chances of winning and why does the 1D care how the lower D's pay out?  After all there is only 37 that they ran against.  Just my thought on it.

I think Aunt B has it here!  Didn't someone already try this at Diamond W last year?

[Megan]

I would not run at a race like this. SOme people wouldnt push their horse hard and they would not improve. Your horse can get to the top at one point or another. It depends on the horse, rider, training, feeding, and work out program. My 1D barrel horse I used to have had no running bloodlines. He was 14.3 if that. But he and I had heart and we practiced and stayed on a sheducle(sp). The horse I have now has came from the 5D to the 3D just since February of this year. He is grade no papers, nothing. Was just sitting in the pasture and he was giving to me after my other horse had to be put down.

[elliemae2u2]

I guess the saying turn and burn would not be a motto for this assocation!!

I don't understand why you have to be so mean about this!

[elliemae2u2]

If you go to the WBR finals results, you'll see the "slower" horses have just as much of a chance to win money as the 2-d horses. The horse that have the most competion are the 3 and 4d horses. We've decided if we go to another one of these huge races (which we have a BLAST at) we will take at least one "slow" horse. Here's how many placed in each D. 1d- 37 horses, 2d-251 horses, 3d-424 horses, 4d-417 horses, 5d-247 horses, 6d-267 horses. I wish you the best of luck with your new venture, but I just wanted to let you know, if you didn't enter the big shows because you didn't think you have a chance, you might want to reconsider. >PEACE<

I think this is a great idea!  But don't you think the faster gals will be complaining that there isn't many places paid out in that "D".  I can see it now!

With those stats - if you are truly wanting to start a new association to cater to the "slower horses".  Why not have a regular D race and pay according to how many horse where in that "D".  37 horses in 1D would pay 3 places, 251 horses in the 2D would pay 12 places (or more), 424 horses in the D would pay 25 places or more, etc etc.  Or after you got the Fastest time and divided like a "D" like a regular barrel race - take the 2D and divide in .25 sec (17.0, 17.25,17.5) and pay out the number of places for that amount of horses.  Slower horses get more chances of winning and why does the 1D care how the lower D's pay out?  After all there is only 37 that they ran against.  Just my thought on it.

[elliemae2u2]

so whats the incentive in bettering myself or my horse?  (((

I notice most of the replies on here is from 15 and 16 second runners and it SHOWS!  The incentive here is for all the poeple who run in the 17 second PLUS range!  So if you have a horse just starting out and he is running 18 and 19's, there is you incentive!  RUN a 17 and win more!  SIMPLE!

The only other thing to make it fair for people that can not spend 20 and 30-k for a horse would be pay the winnings back backwards!   1-d always win more money, so turn it around and pay the 4 or 5 d horse more money!  THIS SHOULD SPARK SOME INTEREST! :TIGGER:

actually .. I dont even own a barrel horse at the moment. I never have and never will own a 1D horse and this association doesnt even appeal to me. So you can take your directing comments away from me because I dont even have a barrel horse. All of my horses are pick up horses or head/heel horses. I dont even have the desire to run barrels anymore. But my daughter does and she rides the horses we already have.

We dont spend lots of $$$$$$ on our horses, our best pick up horse was a bareback horse who quit bucking and made the best ridin/ranch horse ever! She will never go anywhere regardless of how much we are offered and we only paid $1k for her 11 years ago. I have not paid that much more for any of our horses. My husband makes every horse we've ever had and that right there is worth more to me than going out and buying a $20k+ horse. We work hard for what we have.

Hey you guys...I started this just to get feedback and opinions....not for everyone to attack each other! 

[elliemae2u2]

Ok...all you out there that want to see this happen, send me a PM with your email address and location.  So I can get an idea of where everyone is and start thinking about locations.  Also note if you would like to have input and help me come up with some rules.  Maybe all the faster people don't like the idea because it might drop entries and the bigger races, therefore dropping the payouts.  Not sure.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion and won't be "flamed" for it!!!!!  But you guys that are truly interested let me know!

[Megan]

Ok...all you out there that want to see this happen, send me a PM with your email address and location.  So I can get an idea of where everyone is and start thinking about locations.  Also note if you would like to have input and help me come up with some rules.  Maybe all the faster people don't like the idea because it might drop entries and the bigger races, therefore dropping the payouts.  Not sure.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion and won't be "flamed" for it!!!!!  But you guys that are truly interested let me know!

We are not flamming you. You asked for our advice and we are just telling you what we think. It will not drop the number of people at big shows or the payout. I hate to break it to you but It wont. Im not being mean Im just stating a fact. People that are running in the 17s or so are just starting out or their horses are. They are looking to move up therefor they would want to go run with faster horses and go to the big shows so they could season there horse and get them used to the sights

[Aunt B]

Ellie - good thing I looked at this before I checked the Magnolia posts...lol.  I think people are put off by the 17 sec or you are out idea/wording.  I get what you are saying, however I think some don't and won't ever.  Before the "D" ever came about you had the open (top horses that had winnings over $1,000 or $5,000)with maybe 15 to 20 horses and they ran for a 4 place payout at most.  Then you had the "novice" horses.  Start out green and move up.  Again most of the time the most places paid out in a class would be 5 or 6.  We got paid on the number of horses in that class.  None of the money was combined. Even ole 4D horse would eventually win enough money to get out of the novice and no way could you compete in the open.  I guess that where the "cheaters" evolved from.  Still you could win the open or a class and not win more than $100 or so.  Okay - the "D" revolution barrel racing as far as I am concerned and brought in the most money we have ever had the chance to run for in our lives unless we made it to the NFR.

The "D" is a great concept and it is working.  You will ALWAYS have the complainers of "falling in the cracks", been there myself.  I do believe there is a more than one way to skin a cat per say and changing up the payout could work.  After all they said the "D" wouldn't make it and look where it is now.

For a regular 4 or 5 or 6D -I believe in equal payout to all divisions and don't think that it is a deterrent not to run to your ability in way. It has been argued day and night that the 1D horses deserve more money and no incentive to run for the 1D in equal payout.  I believe that is not true.  I have the best of the best 4D horse next to JoEllens infamous Badger..lol  and his shoes cost me $125 every six weeks and his feed is not a discounted rate and he will never be anything but that a 4D horse. Thank God I don't have to pay the vet bills on him!!! Thanks again to my boy, Dr. Kurt Heite who can make the cripple run and the blind see again!!!!! I love him (Spanky and Kurt too...hehe) and enjoy the heck out of riding ole Spanky.  So call us the 4D pair and we love it.  That old man has won more money, buckles, saddles,trailer etc than alot of 1D horses can claim.

Now if you want to make it better for the divisions that put that money in the pot for the 1D's to have big bucks to run at and pay back more places, pay on the number of horses in that "D".  Say it up front in your advertisement and people can choose to come and run or not.  How much fairer can that be?  Good luck to ya and I really hope something like that takes off - I'd sure consider going!!!!  If Diamond W had one going I missed it and I would have gone.  It may just not had enough time to get off the ground.  After all the concept we have now sure didn't take off overnight.  Again - Good luck!

[lilbit]

Whatever ever happened to bettering yourself and your horse? If someone wants to go out there and half a$$ ride and place. Then I do not feel that they should win any money! The person that rides, works hard puts blood,sweet and tears should be the one winning money.  If they are doing that they should be able to place in a 4,5, or 6d at even a big show!

That is all i have to say about this. I feel something like this would make a joke out of being a barrel racer.

THIS IS MY THOUGHTS!![/color]

Good luck

[TxBarrels]

As I said before, I probalby wouldn't go to a barrel race like this, but I do think its a good idea.  Sounds like some people are taking it a little more personally than others.  I think, if you could figure out a good way to go about this, people will show up.  Heck, maybe you could simply make it an "age" association.  Kind of like the youth associations.  Anyway, I push my horses to the limit just like other people on here.  I am always trying to knock thousandths of a second of my time.  Looking for ways to improve.  But I can understand why people would want to run at a race where they have a chance.  With all the high powered horses out there, it gets hard to compete.  I think that every horse has its limit of what it can run.  I don't think every horse can be a 1D horse, just like every person can't be an all star basketball, football, track star.  Some horses may love to run barrels but don't have the athletic ability to compete with a 1D horse.  And I realize that we are all adults here and I know as well as anyone else that there are always going to be losers in any sport.  Not everyone can win all the time and I believe that they should, even as kids.  But, I do think everyone should at least have a CHANCE to win sometimes. Also, I think one person said something about people not even trying to run their horse because they'd basically have a better chance of winning if they just loped the pattern.  I totally agree with that statement.  You would have the so-called cheaters who would come in and lope to win.  Thats why I liked the suggestion of a "bracket" style barrel race.  Win you sign up, you basically choose which D you would be in depending on the pen/pattern size.  Hey, there were a LOT of negative comments about the D barrel races when they first started.  Keep in mind, these types of races haven't been around all that long and people weren't completely open to the idea at first.  This could be the next big thing in barrel races once people got used to the idea.  

The bottom line is that you will NEVER PLEASE EVERYONE.  If you chose to start up this type of association, those who didn't like the idea simply wouldn't come.  Everyone has their own opinions (obviously) and everyone is entitled to that.  

[DOHorsewmn]

I agree with Aunt B - pay more places in the D's that have the most people fall into that category.  I would definitely be all for that.  As you say - advertise it up front.  I think the most complaints are when things are not out in the open or change after the fact.